The United States considers Iraq a part of the worldwide war against terrorism and not a diversion, Secretary of State Colin Powell said in a January 16 interview with ABC Australia.

Saddam Hussein's Iraq was a nation that practiced terror and was developing weapons of mass destruction that could have fallen into the hands of terrorists, Powell asserted, noting the world no longer has worry about this threat. "So we didn't believe it was a detour in the war against terrorism at all," he said. "The war against terrorism continues. We're rolling up al-Qaida cells. They are still dangerous, and we've got to stay with it. It's going to be a long war, as the President said at the very beginning."

Powell expressed skepticism about the feasibility of holding early elections in Iraq as demanded by Shiite cleric Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani. "We think the better way to go is to put in place a basic administrative law -- not a constitution yet, but a basic law to get us started -- and then use a caucus system to come up with a transitional assembly."

Powell strongly defended his U.N. presentation on the evidence of Iraq's possession of weapons of mass destruction, noting that it was a product of intelligence around the world, not just the U.S. "We didn't hype it," he said. "If it wasn't multi-sourced, we didn't use it. And I stand behind it."

As a result of U.S. and coalition military action in Iraq, Powell said, we have "a dictator gone, no more mass graves being filled, and a democratic process being laid out for the Iraqi people."

Department of State
Office of the Press Spokesman
Washington, DC
January 19, 2004

Secretary Colin L. Powell
Interview on ABC Australia With Maxine McKew
Recorded January 16, 2004

MS. MCKEW: Mr. Secretary, if I could start first on the capture of Saddam Hussein. First of all, is he being cooperative with his captors, and what is the timetable for him coming to trial?

SECRETARY POWELL: Well, he is talking to us. I can't say he's being cooperative. He realizes that he will be facing trial. He realizes the difficulties that he is in and what is facing him, so he's trying to protect himself. But he is talking to us, but I can't say that he's being very cooperative.

We want to help the Iraqi people put in place a system to deal with this kind of murderer, and it will take some time to do that. And, of course, I think it's best it be done after the Iraqis have sovereignty in their own country, after the 1st of July. And it will take at least that long to bring all of the charges together and for the Iraqis to do it in a correct way.

We'll be helping them. The international community will be helping them. But it's up to the Iraqi people, and at an appropriate time we will give Saddam Hussein to the Iraqi people for their justice.

MS. MCKEW: One of the immediate political challenge, Mr. Secretary, just briefly. As you know, the chief Shiite cleric, Ayatollah Ali al-Sistani, wants to bypass the plan for a provisional government and begin a process of full elections. How does the U.S. see this?

SECRETARY POWELL: Well, we believe the 15 November plan, as it is called, is the way to go. It would be very difficult to hold the kind of elections that the Ayatollah is asking for in a reasonable time frame, and we think the better way to go is to put in place a basic administrative law -- not a constitution yet, but a basic law to get us started -- and then use a caucus system to come up with a transitional assembly, and let that transitional assembly pick a transitional government, and get that all done by the 1st of July. And then we can take our time after that to put in place a more formal constitution to be ratified by the people, and then the kind of elections that you and I would understand.

The Ayatollah is more interested in seeing if we can not have a more representative way of having the caucus elections for the transitional government. We are listening to him. We think we have the better way to go about it. And as you know, on Monday next, all of this will be discussed at the UN with the Secretary General, with Ambassador Bremer and with representatives of the Governing Council. And hopefully, the UN will be able to play a role in resolving this question.

MS. MCKEW: Okay, if I can turn to the post-Iraq commentary. Some of the critiques, as you know, are coming from within the military from some conservative ranks. I'm thinking particularly of a paper that's been produced by the Army War College. One of its conclusions, in fact, is that Iraq was a detour from the primary goal of the war on terror.

What is your comment on that, sir?

SECRETARY POWELL: This was a paper done by Dr. Jeffrey Record and published by the War College, but not the opinion of the War College. But that was Dr. Record's opinion.

But the President believed very strongly that Iraq was part of the war against terror. A nation that practices terror, that is developing weapons of mass destruction that could fall into the hands of terrorists, and that was willing to use those weapons had to be dealt with. And the UN, for 12 years, had been trying to deal with Iraq and did not succeed.

So the President, and boldly accompanied by Prime Minister Howard and Prime Minister Blair and so many other leaders, decided it was time to act in the name of the international community and safety of the international community. So we didn't believe it was a detour in the war against terrorism at all. The war against terrorism continues. We're rolling up al-Qaida cells. They are still dangerous, and we've got to stay with it. It's going to be a long war, as the President said at the very beginning.

MS. MCKEW: Nonetheless, you acknowledge there is no evidence of a link between Saddam Hussein and al-Qaida?

SECRETARY POWELL: There are clues and there are indications that there were contacts between the two, but we're not overstating the case that there is solid evidence that would connect, for example, Saddam Hussein with what happened on 9/11. But we're still uncovering information, and I think we have presented this in a balanced, careful way. I tried to be very careful and objective in my presentation last February 5th.

MS. MCKEW: So you still stand by everything you said at the UN? You're comfortable with that scenario you laid out?

SECRETARY POWELL: I am very comfortable. What I presented last February 5th was not something I made up in my office. It was a product of the intelligence community, and not just the United States intelligence community, but other intelligence communities around the world that helped us with information. And the Director of Central Intelligence, his Deputy and all of the other leaders of our intelligence community stood behind that presentation. We didn't hype it. If it wasn't multi-sourced, we didn't use it. And I stand behind it.

MS. MCKEW: Nonetheless, don't you think the case for war looks a lot weaker now that we know that Saddam posed no immediate threat to his neighbors or to anyone else? No weapons have been found.

SECRETARY POWELL: Well, I think he was a threat. Just his very presence was a threat. He had the intention and he had the capability, and if he was ever released from UN sanctions or the pressure that was being applied against him, I don't think any thinking person can believe he was suddenly going to decide, "I don't have to have this capability anymore."

Now, we have not found yet large stocks of weapons, so we don't yet know and can't establish what he had in the way of inventory. But what he had in the way of programs to generate inventory and what he had in the way of intentions is absolutely clear, and so we stand by that.

And a lot of the material I presented in February last was what happened to stocks of botulinum and anthrax. He wouldn't account for what happened. And so his failure to account condemned him, right then and there, to be in further material breach of his obligations.

And should the world just say, "Well, he won't account, let's forget about it"? He could have accounted. He could have avoided it. He didn't avoid it. He decided that he would just stiff the United Nations because he believed the United Nations would not act.

Well, the United States, Australia, United Kingdom, Spain, Italy and so many other nations did act, and that's why we are where we are now, with a dictator gone, no more mass graves being filled, and a democratic process being laid out for the Iraqi people.

At the beginning of this conversation, we discussed and debated how to go about putting democracy in place in Iraq. That's a better thing to talk about, and I'm more encouraged talking about that, than I am about weapons of mass destruction that we don't have to worry about anymore or a dictator we don't have to worry about anymore.

MS. MCKEW: Okay. Sir, if I can, just one last question. You don't think, though, that to some extent the U.S. spent 2003 fighting the wrong enemy? If we look at al-Qaida where it is still very active, that is, in a country such as Pakistan, I imagine that's what exercising State Department minds at the moment is that the next attempt on President Musharraf's life could succeed, with frightening results in terms of proliferation.

SECRETARY POWELL: Well, those terrorists didn't just suddenly come out of the woodwork. They have always been there. And what we have to do is go after them. And we have not been diverted in our attention. We have been working with President Musharraf. We have been working with other nations around the world. We put in place protections for our homeland to know who is coming in to our nation.

Other nations are doing likewise. Law enforcement cooperation, intelligence cooperation, breaking up these al-Qaida cells -- all of that has been going on. We've lost none of our energy for that global war against terrorism. And they're responding by trying to hit back, but they will not succeed because the world is united.

And what's the alternative? We must go after these terrorists. We can't let them prevail. We won't let them prevail.

MS. MCKEW: Mr. Secretary, thank you very much for your time.

SECRETARY POWELL: Thank you.