Transcript of Proceeding [PDF 360K]

8:30-9:00am Registration (Marriott Wardman Park Hotel, Marriott Ballroom Salons 1&2)

9:00am-9:15am Welcome and explanation of process
                        Eileen Harrington, Associate Director for Marketing Practices, Federal Trade
                        Commission

9:15-10:45am Proposed National No Call Registry

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Financial Services Association - George Wallace; Association of Fundraising Professionals (AFP) - Michael Rosen; American Resort Development Association - Stratis Pridgeon; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Consumer Choice Coalition - David Maxwell; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Junkbusters - Jason Catlett; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Rex Burlison; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; New York State Consumer Protection Board - TBA; Newspaper Association of America - John Murray; Not-for-Profit and Charitable Coalition - Glenn Mitchell; Private Citizen - Robert Bulmash; Personal Legal Plans - Dennis McGarry; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak

• What should be the interplay between the proposed national registry and state registries?
• Is the scope of coverage of the proposed national registry adequate to protect consumers?
• Should an prior or existing business relationship exemption be added to the proposed Rule, or does the current proposal allowing for individual express verifiable authorization to receive telemarketing calls make such an exemption unnecessary? Instead of express verifiable authorization to specific companies, should the registry allow consumers to opt in to calls from specific groups or categories of goods or services?
• Should businesses be able to register their numbers on the national registry (to prevent calls from companies excepted from the exemption for B2B)?
• Should the do-not-call provisions of the Rule apply to for-profit telemarketers acting on behalf of charities? Should there be a de minimis exemption for small charities or non-profits? Should the Rule exempt religious and political organizations?

10:45-11:00am Break

11:00am-12:00noon Proposed National No Call Registry

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Financial Services Association - George Wallace; Association of Fundraising Professionals (AFP) - Michael Rosen; American Resort Development Association - Stratis Pridgeon; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Consumer Choice Coalition - David Maxwell; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Junkbusters - Jason Catlett; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Rex Burlison; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; New York State Consumer Protection Board - TBA; Newspaper Association of America - John Murray; Not-for-Profit and Charitable Coalition - Glenn Mitchell; Private Citizen - Robert Bulmash; Personal Legal Plans - Dennis McGarry; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak

• Are the safe harbor provisions of the proposed Rule, including the requirement to monitor and enforce compliance, adequate to protect consumers?
• Is the proposed two year trial period problematic and, if so, what can be done to alleviate concerns?
• What obstacles to enforcement are presented by the proposed registry? What modifications could be made to facilitate enforcement?

12:00noon-1:00pm Lunch (on your own)

1:00-1:30pm Implementation of the Proposed National No Call System - A Presentation by Commission Staff

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Financial Services Association - George Wallace; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; CallCompliance - Joseph Sanscrainte; Consumer Choice Coalition - Danielle Fagre; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Privacy Information Center - Chris Hoofnagle; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Gryphon Networks - Keith Fotta; Junkbusters - Jason Catlett; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Rex Burlison; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; NCS Pearson - Cynthia Brockwell; NeuStar, Inc. - Kimberly Miller; New York State Consumer Protection Board - TBA; Newspaper Association of America - John Murray; Not For Profit and Charitable Coalition - Glenn Mitchell; Personal Legal Plans - Dennis McGarry; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak; SBC Communications - Jeffrey Lee Scruggs; Tellme Networks, Inc. - Gregory O’Connell

1:30-2:45pm Implementation - Consumer Registration and Use Issues

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Financial Services Association - George Wallace; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; CallCompliance - Joseph Sanscrainte; Consumer Choice Coalition - Danielle Fagre; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Privacy Information Center - Chris Hoofnagle; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Gryphon Networks - Keith Fotta; Junkbusters - Jason Catlett; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Rex Burlison; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; NCS Pearson - Cynthia Brockwell; NeuStar, Inc. - Kimberly Miller; New York State Consumer Protection Board - TBA; Newspaper Association of America - John Murray; Not For Profit and Charitable Coalition - Glenn Mitchell; Personal Legal Plans - Dennis McGarry; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak; SBC Communications - Jeffrey Lee Scruggs; Tellme Networks, Inc. - Gregory O’Connell

• How much information is necessary for verification purposes? Will automated number identification (ANI) data be sufficient? If so, how can those consumers whose phones do not transmit ANI be added to the list?
• Should third-parties be allowed to register on behalf of consumers?
• How long should numbers stay on the registry? Is it feasible to take numbers off the registry when they change hands?
• How will consumers report violations of their do not call rights? What has been the states’ experience with complaint handling?

2:45-3:00pm Break

3:00-4:30pm Implementation - Industry Perspective

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Financial Services Association - George Wallace; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; CallCompliance - Joseph Sanscrainte; Consumer Choice Coalition - James Miller; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Privacy Information Center - Chris Hoofnagle; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Gryphon Networks - Keith Fotta; Junkbusters - Jason Catlett; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Rex Burlison; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; NCS Pearson - Cynthia Brockwell; NeuStar, Inc. - Kimberly Miller; New York State Consumer Protection Board - TBA; Newspaper Association of America - John Murray; Not For Profit and Charitable Coalition - Glenn Mitchell; Personal Legal Plans - Dennis McGarry; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak; SBC Communications - Jeffrey Lee Scruggs; Tellme Networks, Inc. - Gregory O’Connell

• Is the prohibition against selling, purchasing or using the registry for any purpose other than to comply with Rule provision overly burdensome for businesses?
• Should the Rule explicitly require telemarketers to purchase the list?
• Are monthly updates adequate? Are they too burdensome?
• Would it be acceptable to have the vendor who operates the national registry “scrub” telemarketers’ lists rather than providing a list of those numbers on the registry?

4:30-5:00pm Open Mike

Thursday, June 6, 2002

8:30-9:00am Registration (Marriott Wardman Park Hotel, Marriott Ballroom Salons 1&2)

9:00-10:30am Predictive Dialers

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Rex Burlison; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; Newspaper Association of America - John Murray; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak; Sytel Limited - Michael McKinlay

• What are the costs of zero abandonment to sellers and telemarketers? What are the costs to consumers of dead air and delayed interaction telemarketing calls?
• What alternatives to zero abandonment exist that would be beneficial to consumers and business?

10:30-10:45am Break

10:45-11:15am Caller ID

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Rex Burlison; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak; SBC Communications - Sid L. Underwood

• What is the current state of caller identification technology? Is it now possible for telemarketers to transmit caller ID information over trunk or T1 lines?
• Is a prohibition on blocking caller ID sufficient to protect consumers?
• Is allowing for substitution of information transmitted, provided it benefits consumers, a reasonable approach?

11:15-11:45am Proposed Changes to Various Deceptive Practices Provisions

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Resort Development Association - Stratis Pridgeon; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Anne Schneider; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak; U.S. Department of Justice - Jonathan Rusch

• Are the proposed modifications regarding disclosures and prohibited misrepresentations in the sale of credit card loss protection meaningful and appropriate?
• Is the expansion of the prize promotion disclosure beneficial to consumers, and minimally burdensome to businesses?

11:45am-12:45pm Lunch (on your own)

12:45-2:45pm Preacquired Account Information

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Financial Services Association - George Wallace; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Consumer Choice Coalition - George Thomas; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; Minnesota Attorney General - Prentiss Cox; National Association of Attorneys General - Anne Schneider; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak; Time, Inc. - Roger Kirkpatrick

• Is the proposed prohibition on receiving or disclosing consumers’ billing information sufficient to protect consumers from unauthorized charges?
• Is the definition of “billing information” too broad”? How should the term be defined?
• What benefits do businesses receive from using preacquired account telemarketing? What benefits do consumers receive from the use of preacquired account telemarketing?
• What other approaches should the Commission consider to address the problem of unauthorized charges resulting from the use of preacquired account information in telemarketing?

2:45-3:00pm Break

3:00-4:30pm Up-selling and Cross-selling

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Financial Services Association - George Wallace; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Consumer Choice Coalition - George Thomas; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; Minnesota Attorney General - Prentiss Cox; National Association of Attorneys General - Anne Schneider; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak; Time, Inc. - Roger Kirkpatrick

• Is the proposed definition of “outbound call” overly broad?
• What other approaches should the Commission consider to address the information deficit and unauthorized charges consumers experience as a result of lack of disclosures in upselling and cross-selling situations?
• Are there different benefits/burdens to business and/or consumers of different forms of upselling and cross-selling? Should these different selling techniques be treated differently under the Rule?

4:30-5:00pm Open Mike


 

Friday, June 7, 2002

8:30-9:00am Registration (Marriott Wardman Park Hotel, Marriott Ballroom Salons 2&3)

9:00-10:30am Express Verifiable Authorization

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Resort Development Association - Stratis Pridgeon; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Consumer Choice Coalition - George Thomas; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Elliot Burg; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; Newspaper Association of America - John Murray; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak

• Would the proposed requirement that telemarketers obtain express verifiable authorization when accepting payment via novel methods adequately protect consumers?
• What costs would businesses incur to comply with this proposed change?
• Are there alternatives that would provide consumers needed protections without requiring express verifiable authorization?
• Are businesses burdened by the proposal to delete the provision allowing a telemarketer to obtain express verifiable authorization by sending written confirmation of the transaction to the consumer prior to submitting billing information?

10:30-10:45am Break

10:45am-1:00pm USA PATRIOT Act Amendments

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Association of Fundraising Professionals - Paulette Maehara; Community Safety - J. Michael Callan; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Hudson Bay Company of Illinois - Thomas Goodman; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; Make-a-Wish Foundation of America - David Mulvihill; National Association of Attorneys General - Elliot Burg; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; Not-for-Profit and Charitable Coalition - Glenn Mitchell; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak

• Are the proposed prohibited misrepresentations adequate to protect donors? Are they overly burdensome to charities?
• Are the proposed disclosures adequate to protect donors? Are they overly burdensome to charities?
• Is the definition of “charitable contribution” a workable one? Are “political clubs, committees or parties” and “constituted religious organizations...” appropriately excluded from that definition?

1:00-2:00pm Lunch (on your own)

2:00-2:30pm Prison-based Telemarketing

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Citizens United for Rehabilitation of Errants - Thomas Petersik; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Enterprise Prison Institute - Knut Rostad; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; Michael Worsham, Esq. - Michael Worsham; National Association of Attorneys General - Elliot Burg; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak

• Is the FTC the appropriate agency to regulate prison-based telemarketing? If not, who,
  if anyone, is?
• Do the costs of using prisoners to conduct telemarketing outweigh the benefits?
• Is a ban necessary, or would disclosures adequately protect consumers?

2:30-4:30pm Proposed Changes to the Exemptions in the TSR

Participants:

AARP - Jeff Kramer; American Teleservices Association - Tyler Prochnow; Dial America - Arthur Conway; Direct Marketing Association - H. Robert Wientzen; Direct Selling Association - John Webb; Electronic Retailing Association - Elissa Myers; Funeral Consumers Alliance - Lisa Carlson; International Cemetery and Funeral Association - Paul Elvig; Magazine Publishers of America - Rita Cohen; National Association of Attorneys General - Elliot Burg; National Association of Realtors - Tom Ceponis; National Consumers League - Susan Grant; National Retail Federation - Mallory Duncan; Not-for-Profit and Charitable Coalition - Glenn Mitchell; Personal Legal Plans - Dennis McGarry; Promotion Marketing Association - Edward Kabak; SBC Communications - Stuart Kivowitz; Software & Information Industry Association - Mark Bohannon; Yellow Pages Integrated Media Association - Len Bussey

• Will requiring compliance with do-not-call, caller ID, and threats provisions of the Rule for exempt sellers and telemarketers of franchises, pay-per-call, and those whose sales involve a face-to-face meeting before payment be burdensome for business?
• What impact will the newly proposed exceptions to general media exemption (for credit card loss protection plans and business opportunities other than those covered by the Franchise Rule) have on businesses and consumers?
• What impact will the newly proposed exceptions to direct mail exemption (for credit card loss protection plans and business opportunities other than those covered by the Franchise Rule) have on businesses and consumers?
• Is the proposed interpretation that e-mail and facsimile messages are direct mail appropriate?
• Should preneed funeral and cemetery sales be excepted from the face-to-face exemption?
• Is it appropriate to except charitable solicitations from the business to business exemption?
• Is it appropriate to except the sale of Internet or Web services from the business to business exemption
   

4:30-5:00pm Open Mike