For Immediate Release
Office of the Press Secretary
December 20, 2001
Press Briefing by Ari Fleischer
12:36 P.M. EST
MR. FLEISCHER: Good afternoon. Let me give
you a walk-through on the President's day. And then I have
two announcements I'd like to make. One, the President this
morning called the President of Djibouti to thank him for the strong
support that Djibouti has given to the United States in the war against
terrorism. Following that, the President had his briefing
with the Central Intelligence Agency, the FBI, and then he convened a
meeting of the Homeland Security Council.
The President, shortly, right after this briefing, will depart for
Martha's Table, which is a Washington-based charity that helps
low-income children and teenagers so they can receive meals and
supervised literacy and learning programs. While there, the
President will make remarks about the importance of charitable giving
at this time of year by the American people to support charities like
Martha's Table, and he will also talk about the need for Congress to
take action to help other Americans so they don't lose their jobs or
get left behind, as well.
The President will return to the White House, and at 2:45 p.m., in
the Rose Garden, the President will have an event where he will give a
report on the first 100 days of the war against
terrorism. And he will also make an announcement about
action he has taken on the financial front against other groups as part
of the war against terrorism.
Two announcements for you. The President today signed an
executive order creating a presidential emergency board on the United
Airlines and International Association of Machinists and Aerospace
Workers matter. The President is concerned about the
economy, particularly after September 11th, and the effect that airline
strikes would have on the economy, on the ability of the public to
travel at this time. The President is also very concerned
about the combination of an impact on the traveling public and the
economy, and he urges all parties to work together to resolve their
differences. But the President has signed the order creating
the presidential emergency board.
And finally, the President is very pleased with the action taken in
the House of Representatives this morning. He thanks the
members of both parties who voted to give the economy a boost, to
protect workers who are working in jobs where they fear they may lose
their jobs, as well as giving a helping hand to the hundreds of
thousands who have lost their jobs recently.
The action taken by the House the President believes is very
constructive. He's particularly grateful to the Democrats
who voted for this measure, as well as to the congressional and the
House leadership. The President hopes still that the Senate will take
action. The word in the Senate is not as encouraging, but
the President continues to believe it's vital for the Senate to take
action to help protect the economy, to help workers so they don't lose
their jobs, and to give a helping hand to people who have already lost
theirs.
Ron, I'd be happy to take questions.
Q A question on both of those. On
the stimulus, the President has the authority to call Congress back
early. The Speaker suggested that he do
that. Will he? And the first matter, can you tell
us what that executive order does? It proposes a cooling-off
period, or something like that?
MR. FLEISCHER: On the presidential emergency board, this
is an authority the President has which kicks in a 30-day clock that
allows the presidential emergency board to review the information
concerning the strike, or potential strike, and to make recommendations
on how to solve it. There can be a second 30-day cooling-off
period in which the parties have an opportunity to review the PEB's
recommendations and to continue to resolve their
differences. So you can look at this as a cooling-off
period.
Q And then will he call Congress back
early?
MR. FLEISCHER: I think the Speaker's call was
specifically about the Senate. I'm aware of how he phrased
it -- I think he was referring to specifically the
Senate. And the President hopes it doesn't have to come to
that. I can't indicate whether the President would do
something like that, but the President would be very disappointed if
the Senate were to go home and leave America's workers behind.
Q But he's leaving open that possibility?
MR. FLEISCHER: That's a determination the Senate will
make, depending on the action. But it's up to the Senate to
decide what to do. The President has not given up
hope. He continues to hope that the Senate will take
action. It's just hard to imagine the Senate leaving town
and leaving America's workers behind.
Q But you're leaving open the possibility
that if the Senate goes home without a bill, that he will call back
Congress early?
MR. FLEISCHER: I have not talked to the President about
that. I'm aware of what the Speaker
said. Fundamentally, it still remains the job of the Senate
leadership to complete their business.
Q Does the President see any particular
urgency to make a disposition in the Walker case to accommodate the
holiday schedule?
MR. FLEISCHER: John, I talked to the President shortly
before the briefing about this matter, and the President is continuing
to receive recommendations about the best course of action in regard to
Mr. Walker. The agencies have not made any final determinations;
neither have the President. And so I do not anticipate
anything this week on this matter. I don't even know if anything will
happen next week. The President thinks it's important to be
thorough, to be deliberative, to be judicious. More
information needs to be gathered. So there's nothing
imminent.
Q There's no recommendations, nothing has
been ruled out or in?
MR. FLEISCHER: Helen, he hears from his
advisors. He hasn't heard from all his
advisors. He'll continue to hear from his advisors, but no
determination has been made.
Q Do you know of reports that he has ruled
out treason?
MR. FLEISCHER: The President hasn't ruled anything in or
out because no determinations have been made. And he hasn't
received all the word yet from the investigators, from the
advisors. So this has moved a little bit beyond what we
talked about this morning. I don't anticipate anything being
imminent.
Q Is that based on the recommendation of the
Secretary of Defense, who said, whoa, what are we moving so fast for?
MR. FLEISCHER: It's based on the entire
information-gathering process.
Q And given that this is an individual
American who is in an extraordinary situation, really, what's the scale
of involvement of the government in determining what the charges should
be against him? Who is involved?
MR. FLEISCHER: Well, this is an extraordinary set of
circumstances, to have an American who apparently was engaged in armed
combat against the United States of America. And it's in
Afghanistan, and as you can imagine in anything that involves matters
that are of the law, there's an information-gathering
process. This information-gathering process is in
Afghanistan. There are people who have to be talked to to
determine what took place; there could be witnesses. So
that's --
Q Is he still being deprived of a lawyer?
MR. FLEISCHER: -- why it requires a lot of
information-gathering. And it will take the amount of time that is
wise and necessary to take.
Q And can you give us a sense of the scale
of the consultations that the President is engaged in? In
other words, what agencies are contributing to this decision?
MR. FLEISCHER: This is primarily at the level of the
Attorney General, the Department of Justice, the Department of
Defense. As you can imagine, those are the two entities that
are involved in this. Mr. Walker is being treated within his
rights under the Geneva Convention and he's a battlefield detainee, and
that's why Defense and the Attorney General Office are the principal
advisors involved.
But as the President typically does, he has a broad leadership
style, he likes to listen to the ideas of his national security
team. And that's what he'll do.
Q One more. Do you know if he's
been Mirandized?
MR. FLEISCHER: I do not.
Q At what point can he have a lawyer?
MR. FLEISCHER: Under both the law and under the
Constitution, in accordance with the Geneva Convention regarding the
treatment of prisoners of war, military intelligence agencies may
question prisoners for information -- that's a military value -- in the
conduct of the war without the presence of a lawyer. He
would have a right to a lawyer if he requests one when he's held on
what's called custodial interrogation by law enforcement
personnel. And that's a different circumstance than where he
is now, under his rights under the Geneva Convention.
Q Ari, one thing -- I know you can't talk
about if there's any determination, and you said it has not been made,
but is there some concern about treason in the sense that the legal
requirement is burdensome and the difficulty to prove such a charge
against Walker?
MR. FLEISCHER: Okay, I'm just not going to comment about
recommendations that the President is still in the process of
receiving. The process -- in the President's opinion, the best way to
handle this process is carefully, thoroughly, and
methodically. And that's why he will allow the investigators
to complete their work in the time frame that they think is
wisest. And the President will let them do their jobs, he
will listen to their advice, and at the appropriate time when -- you
will hear from either the agencies or the people involved.
Q Can I just follow up on that? I
know the President's father I believe was on ABC yesterday, and I think
he spoke about a unique penalty for Walker, something to the effect --
I don't have the transcript in front of me -- but having him sort of
walk around the United States and he could sort of see how people in
this country feel. Did the President see what his father
said, and any reaction to that?
MR. FLEISCHER: Well, since you don't have the transcript
in front of me, I wouldn't want to comment on anything involving what
the President's father had said.
Q Did the President see what his father said
about Walker?
MR. FLEISCHER: I have not heard -- Kelly, I have not
heard the President on that topic.
Elizabeth, you seem to have a question.
Q I don't have a transcript, but I do
remember what the President said. He said he should be
forced to parade around the United States so people could see him, and
treat him badly, apparently. Does the President have any
reaction to that, again?
MR. FLEISCHER: Again, I have not heard the President
weigh in on what the President said.
Q Can I ask another question? You
said that the President has received many recommendations, but nothing
is final yet.
MR. FLEISCHER: Well, I said the President is receiving
recommendations. I don't believe I used the word, "many."
Q So if we're talking about the Justice
Department and Defense we're talking about two recommendations here.
MR. FLEISCHER: And I indicated that as the President
does, his leadership style, he'll listen to other voices on the
security team, as appropriate.
Q Ari, under the Geneva Convention, a
battlefield detainee apparently can receive mail. Do you
have any knowledge as to whether or not he's able to receive mail?
MR. FLEISCHER: I do not know.
Q His parents have put out a statement
saying, asking America to be patient, wait for all the facts to come
out. Do you have any comment on their saying that?
MR. FLEISCHER: No, I don't. And I think what
you have to understand at a time like this, too, is anything that is
involving the legal course of action is not something that I'm going to
be in a position to give you a minute-by-minute,
play-by-play. You have to allow a process to be thorough, to
be deliberative, and to be judicious. So I'm not going to
comment on every wiggle of every report, or every nook and cranny in
these developments.
Q Ari, back to the
stimulus. Despite the President's wishes, the Senate has
made it clear it intends to leave without doing -- voting on the House
bill. There are a couple of other pieces of legislation that
aren't going to get done. Are we back to politics as usual?
MR. FLEISCHER: Well, the President certainly hopes
not. And that's why he asked the Secretary of the Treasury
to contact the Senate leadership this morning, and Chairman Baucus this
morning, to see if we still can't get an agreement. The
House of Representatives has reached an agreement. The House of
Representatives has been able to act. The President hopes
the Senate will be able to act.
I did hear this morning different senators use -- one senator used
the word, "charade," another senator used the word,
"dead." But in the President's opinion, the strength of the
economy and the hopes of America's workers are too important for the
stimulus to be declared dead. And to the people who are
unemployed, or people who may lose their jobs, this isn't a
charade. This is their lives. That's why it's so
important for the Senate to act.
Q You need 12 Democrats. How many
do you have now?
MR. FLEISCHER: I don't do vote counts. But
the only reason you would need 60 votes is if a senator were to throw
up a parliamentary blocking tactic, which is their prerogative, they
have that right. The President would hope that at a time
like this, at a time of recession, no senator would seek to do that.
Q What happened to O'Neill's
efforts? What happened to O'Neill's phone call?
MR. FLEISCHER: The Secretary spoke with the Majority
Leader, and the Secretary indicated a willingness to work together to
reach an agreement on the health provisions. And then I
think the Secretary was surprised to hear that now everything needs to
be rediscussed; it's not just the health issues that are a source of
concern in the Senate among the Democrats, they now seem to be
indicating that there's no agreement on anything.
Q That's what Daschle indicated to O'Neill?
MR. FLEISCHER: I think I would refer you to the
appropriate offices, but that's how the conversation was brought to me
-- that's correct.
Q Did he also speak to Baucus, as well?
MR. FLEISCHER: He did.
Q Similar response?
Q Can I go back to Walker? I just
want to clarify. You were talking about his status as a
battlefield detainee, and so, therefore, you don't have to provide him
access to a lawyer right now. But as the recommendations are
made and you figure out how he's going to be tried, is it possible that
his status would change? And how would that work?
MR. FLEISCHER: It is. Sure. If it
were decided that he move from his status as a battlefield detainee to
a time where he would be held in what's called custodial interrogation,
then he would, of course, have different legal rights. He
has legal rights under the Geneva Convention which are being fully
complied with. He has legal rights as an American if he were
to be put in a position of custodial interrogation.
Q Did you say that there will be no decision
on Walker this week and next, or just this week?
MR. FLEISCHER: I said nothing is imminent. I
do not expect anything this week. I can't tell you there
will be anything next week. It's possible it will be after
that, even.
Q What I really wanted to ask, though, was
has there been any decisions made on the al Qaeda members who have been
captured, how they'll be handled? And is it possible we
could have a decision on them this week?
MR. FLEISCHER: I'd refer you to DOD on that.
Q Ari, the situation in Argentina is
deteriorating by the minute. The number of dead has risen
dramatically, the number of injured, riots all over the country, the
Cabinet has resigned -- the Economics Minister has
resigned. You said this morning that Washington considers
Argentina a very special friend and a special ally. What is
the White House doing, or what can the U.S. government do to help
President de la Rua at this moment?
MR. FLEISCHER: Argentina is a valued ally and friend,
and the United States is monitoring developments in
Argentina. We are concerned about the events. But
it's also very important to note that Argentina has a strong and
vibrant democracy. And President de la Rua is working hard
to resolve the situation, and we want this democratically-elected
government to succeed.
Q Is there any way that Secretary O'Neill
can contact the IMF to see if measures can be taken? Because
the situation is dire -- I don't even know a stronger word --
desperate, probably.
MR. FLEISCHER: Well, we continue to hope and want
Argentina to work with the IMF to resolve the situation in a way that
leads toward what is necessary, and that is sustainable economic
growth.
Q The President has said -- back on Walker
-- that he's an American citizen. And, yet, we read in
reports some speculation that in engaging in combat against the United
States he may have given that up. Is it conceivable that he
could be determined to have relinquished, renounced his American
citizenship?
MR. FLEISCHER: I don't know. That's a
question I think you need to address to the lawyers who are involved.
Q Back on the stimulus
package. Why, in your view, has the President been sort of
unable to translate his political popularity into getting the kind of
stimulus bill that he wants through the Senate? What's the
disconnect here?
MR. FLEISCHER: That's an interesting
question. I think the President clearly recognizes how
difficult it is for the leadership to govern the
Senate. That was true when the Republicans controlled the
Senate; it's true now. The Senate is a very narrowly divided
institution. It's a 51-49 split between the Democrats and
the Republicans. The Republicans are, almost to the person,
united. There are some splits within the Democrat
ranks. And I think anytime a leader faces splits the way the
Democrats in the Senate do, it puts the leader on the
spot. It's difficult to be the leader at a time like this.
Clearly, there are enough Democratic senators who support this
centrist proposal that if a majority were allowed to prevail, a
majority would prevail and help would be on the way to the unemployed
and to the economy.
The Leader of the Senate is faced with a situation where the
majority of his rank and file oppose this agreement. There's
a minority within his rank and file that support it. He has
to make a difficult choice: Does he side with the minority,
that can block this? Or the majority, that can lead to
bipartisanship and results for the country.
It's difficult to be the Leader of the Senate, and the President
recognizes that. Nevertheless, the President continues to
believe that at the end of the day, all of us here in Washington will
get judged on how well people have been able to come together and work
for the country -- which is why President Bush has gone the extra mile
and has asked Secretary O'Neill again to contact the Senate this
morning. That's why, in the substance of the package, the
President has changed from his original proposal, which offered $6
billion of support for dislocated workers now to $39 billion of support
for dislocated workers. The President has moved a
mile. We hope when we are just inches away that the Senate
leadership will agree to move, as well.
Q At what point, then, does he decided to
simply take this issue to the country, to let it be decided next
November?
MR. FLEISCHER: Number one, again, the President just
continues to hope that the Senate won't just pack up their bags today
and go home and leave America's workers behind. If they do,
I think the likelihood, looking into next year, is that there are two
things that can happen. One is, much of the foundation for
economic recovery and growth has been laid as a result of the
bipartisan agreement earlier this year that provided a pre-September
11th stimulus to the economy, and that was the tax cut, which was
supported by 12 Senate Democrats -- of course, it was opposed by the
Senate leadership, but it was supported by a very large number of
Senate Democrats. It passed with 62 votes in the Senate.
That stimulus package has laid the groundwork for an economic
recovery. The President, as an insurance policy, would like
to make sure that that recovery takes place sooner and is more
robust. Therefore, even at the end of this Congress, it is
still conceivable -- this session of the Congress, that the Senate can
come back in just a month's time and pass the
stimulus. Perhaps they'll go back home and hear from their
constituents. Perhaps they'll hear from the unemployed or from people
who currently cling to jobs, who fear they're going to lose their
jobs.
So the Congress continues. The Senate will return, and
the President won't give up home. He thinks it's too
important.
Q Just for clarification's sake, I know you
keep resting the hands of this decision on Senator Daschle alone, in
terms of a simple majority vote, but doesn't it really work that you
require unanimous consent by the Senate to wave a 60 vote?
MR. FLEISCHER: Actually, Paula, it is singularly the
determination of the Majority Leader of the Senate, regardless of their
party, to schedule a vote. A vote can be
scheduled. So he has that power to schedule a vote. Of
course, a Senator could make a motion to block consideration of any
type of agreement, but it still can be scheduled to vote, and then
we'll see what the Senate does. Let the Senate work its
will. Let's see if a majority can hold.
Q But his argument is there's no point in
scheduling a vote which does not have unanimous consent to waive.
MR. FLEISCHER: I think again, that's a formula for
gridlock and inaction. And that's the type of thing the
American people have tired of. If the formula in the Senate is, only
100 votes will do, than most of the major legislation that's passed in
recent time -- I think it's fair to say any piece of major legislation
is doomed. It should be the job of the Senate leadership to
find a way to get things done. It's easy to find a way to
doom things. It's harder to find a way to get things
done. But that's why everybody is elected, and that's why
people come together in this town.
Q There's an effort underway that if this
does not -- if this is not passed, to at least pull out some of the
provisions, such as victim's relief, New York economic incentives,
perhaps some tax extenders. Would the President support a
smaller package that at least allows Congress to leave town without
leaving everybody behind?
MR. FLEISCHER: Well, I'm not going to speculate about
any hypotheticals. The House was able to do it, and there's
no reason the Senate shouldn't, particularly when there's a bipartisan
majority that's there to get it done.
Q When you were talking about Argentina, you
didn't mention any possibility of a bilateral aid package or a
bilateral loan, which the U.S. has used in the past, successfully,
Mexico being an example. Can you elaborate on any thinking
on that?
MR. FLEISCHER: My statement speaks for itself about the
importance of working with the International Monetary Fund.
Q Ari, in the past, Presidents have
sometimes used the Christmas season as an opportunity to issue
pardons. Is President Bush considering any this year?
MR. FLEISCHER: I'm not going to speculate about anything
involving pardons. If the President has anything to
announce, he will -- he or the appropriate officials at the Department
of Justice would make the announcement.
Q A quick one on the
Olympics. With the torch arriving in Washington Saturday,
does the President plan any festivities, and does he plan to go the
Olympics?
MR. FLEISCHER: As you know, we don't discuss travel this
far ahead of time. We'll keep you posted about any
announcements. So there's nothing I can offer on that
immediately.
Q Can you at least tell us about Saturday?
Q Ari, we saw Speaker Hastert come
in. Is he meeting with the President? Are they
talking about economic stimulus? What can you tell us about
that?
MR. FLEISCHER: The Speaker, from time to time, comes
down to the White House. And the President and the Speaker
are eating lunch, as we speak.
Q Are they discussing economic stimulus,
maybe what happens next?
MR. FLEISCHER: I don't know, because I'm in here with
you.
Q Ari, I just wanted -- back on the Walker
case, I just wanted to ask you if the President might consider a
Christmas season visit to Walker by his parents, either under
international custody, as he is now, or under --
MR. FLEISCHER: That's something you need to address to
Department of Defense. That's not something the President
decides.
Q Is there any preference here for some sort
of plea agreement with Walker, rather than going to a public trial?
MR. FLEISCHER: Nobody has even brought any charges
forward, so I think it's hard to discuss pleas.
Q Ari, apparently on a close listening to
the Osama bin Laden tape by people who speak Arabic, there are parts of
that tape which were not included in the official government
translation, including specific references to several Saudi clerics,
and a reference to the visitor to that dinner coming through
Iran. Do you have any comment on why parts of that might not
have been included in the official translation? And is there
a secondary translation that was not released to the public?
MR. FLEISCHER: Terry, that's the first I've heard of
that report. I'm not aware of it, haven't heard of it. And
I believe it was handed out, in terms of the transcript, identified him
as a Saudi cleric. I think that's what it
said. So anything -- it obviously said.
Q But in conversation, there was apparently
references to other Saudi clerics not included in the transcript.
MR. FLEISCHER: I'm not aware of that
report. I have no idea if it's accurate or
not. But you might want to ask DOD. They're the
ones who brought in the group of translators to do it. I
have heard no complaints about it.
Q On Walker, can you confirm, is he still on
board the Peleliu, or has he been moved, and if he has been moved,
where he has been moved to?
MR. FLEISCHER: My latest information is that he is on
board the Peleliu. I have heard nothing that would suggest
otherwise.
Q Ari, the nominations of Eugene Scalia and
Otto Reich seem to be going nowhere. You have spoken from
this podium on repeated occasions. Has the President spoken directly
with Eugene Scalia or Otto Reich?
MR. FLEISCHER: I don't know if he's had direct
conversations with them. I know that the President feels
very strongly about the need, again, in what could be the last day of
the Senate, for the Senate to take action not only on those two
important nominees, but on the many judges and other people who have
been appointed. At last look, there were more than 150 names
that the Senate has failed to act on.
We have spent a good bit of this briefing talking about whether
what Mr. Walker and a possible trial in a federal or civilian
court. We talked earlier about military tribunals, and that
many Democrats want to make certain that any trial is held in a
civilian court. It will be very helpful if the Senate would
confirm the President's judges. It makes it easier to have
trials in civilian courts if the Senate confirms judges for civilian
courts. There's no connection between the fate in these
matters, or what the court will go -- which court will be heard, but
it's just another reminder of how important it is for the Senate to
confirm justices.
Thank you.
END 1:00 P.M. EST
|